Transcript

[00:00:00] Multiple Voices: Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. Fundraising everywhere. , you don’t need to add me in there.

[00:00:31] Jade Cunnah: Welcome to the Fundraising Everywhere podcast. Your go-to place for fundraising tips and inspiration. Love what you hear. Get more insights straight to your inbox. Subscribe to our email list for exclusive fundraising resources, early access to training, special discounts, and more. Just head on over to fundraising everwhere.com/podcast to subscribe Now onto today’s episode, enjoy.

[00:00:59] Simon Scriver: Why does everyone, why does everyone default to, we use MailChimp as well. Does it? Why does everyone default to MailChimp? I 

[00:01:03] Sarah Goddard: think it’s because what, it’s what I learned in the charity sector and I’ve just stuck with what works. Um, I knew it, I was familiar with it, so there’s probably other platforms, but the, the, the moving it all over is a job in and of itself.

[00:01:16] Simon Scriver: Yeah. Well, everyone keeps saying there’s better ones, but I think, yeah, they must have done a big campaign towards charities years ago, and now they’re just like locked in. Everyone loves mail. 

[00:01:26] Sarah Goddard: I think, um, they had, I think they had really good free plans for the longest time for charities. Like, I think it was like a good few thousand people, unlimited amounts of emails.

[00:01:34] Sarah Goddard: You could use all the features and then they’ve slowly reduced how much charity can actually use. Yeah. 

[00:01:39] Simon Scriver: Yeah. That’s fair. Alright, um, well let’s kick us off. This is the Fundraising of Rare Podcast. Uh, my name is Simon Reiber. We are, uh, streaming live today. Um, to LinkedIn as well. So you might be watching this live on LinkedIn, or you may be listening back on the fundraising of our podcast.

[00:01:55] Simon Scriver: Either way. Really happy to have you here. Uh, my name is Simon and I am joined today by the wonderful, well, we’re talking about welcome journeys today in particular. Um, but, but I could talk to Sarah Godard about anything. So, hello Sarah. Welcome to the fundraiser. You, you no doubt I’m fundraising, don’t you?

[00:02:12] Simon Scriver: I think that’s why I like talking to you. ’cause you are, you are a big, big fundraiser by heart, aren’t you? What’s your background? 

[00:02:17] Sarah Goddard: Absolutely. I have been in sector, ooh, better part of two decades. I started out in face-to-face fundraising, so on a high street near you with a clipboard. I’m sure they’ve all got very high tech iPads and things nowadays.

[00:02:28] Sarah Goddard: But old school paper paperclip board, um, discovered. I really like the telling stories, talking to people about charities, inspiring them. Would rather do it without standing out in the blistering heat or the freezing cold snow. Um. Did an internship, fell into fundraising that way a little bit and. Still here 20 years, nearly 18, 20 years later.

[00:02:45] Sarah Goddard: Really? So 

[00:02:46] Simon Scriver: it’s amazing. And you’ve got a great track record. ’cause you, I love your, your background. You’ve worked with a lot of small organizations and medium organizations, like real mix of science. 

[00:02:55] Jade Cunnah: Mm-hmm. 

[00:02:56] Simon Scriver: Um, and, and it’s very impressive. And these days you work with a lot of people helping them in, in lots of areas, but.

[00:03:01] Simon Scriver: You’re very public fundraiser, very community fundraising minded. And aren’t you? And I, I will remind people, we, Sarah is cur curating with us our, um, our community fundraising conference on fundraising everywhere, which is happening 19th of June. But you’re a big community head, aren’t you? Like that’s where you spend a lot your time is helping people boost their community fundraising.

[00:03:22] Sarah Goddard: Absolutely. Yeah. So I started, I started off in events initially, as I think many fundraisers often do. Then that grew into doing community as well. Um, over the years I got seconded into individual giving and learn all of that, and really understood how those areas work closely together. I think once upon a time, they were very much, I.

[00:03:39] Sarah Goddard: Neither the twain shall meet. Whereas now charities are bringing those areas closer together, which I feel very passionately about because they’re all our supporters and however they choose to give our jobs are to inspire and give them the opportunity to get involved in lots of different ways. And one of the most powerful ways of doing that is absolutely engaging the community, whether it’s a local community, if you’re in a particular geographical area or.

[00:03:59] Sarah Goddard: Who are our community of supporters? Who are the people that our core speaks to, their values and their motivations and the change they wanna see in the world. Let’s engage those communities and, yeah, I can’t, you shouldn’t pick favorites with fundraising, but I’ll be honest, community fundraising will always be my true love, and I’ll be up on that soapbox, banging the drum for how awesome community fundraising is.

[00:04:19] Sarah Goddard: As long as I’m fundraising, I reckon. 

[00:04:21] Simon Scriver: But you, you make the valid, very valid point that it’s, it’s not in isolation, no form of fundraising is like, it spills out into your corporate, into your, even your trust. It spills out into your ig. Like it’s all connected. And I think that’s one of the reasons I wanted to talk to you today was, was focusing on that almost that, um, well, the welcome journeys we’re talking about, but that, that supporter experience, ’cause we’ve got a supporter experience conference happening as well this month.

[00:04:45] Simon Scriver: Um, and so. Maybe you could talk me through your idea of a welcome journey or how you view welcome journeys for people. I mean, for me it’s like. You know, these people who are just coming onto our list and, and those early days of it, that’s a very simplified thing. But what, what do you mean when you talk about welcome journey, Sarah?

[00:05:05] Sarah Goddard: Yeah, absolutely. So there is that, that core bread and butter that often it’s our email, email list. It’s, um, Alex Fair often talks a lot about that’s your only platform that you own. So don’t worry too much about building social media. Build your email list. And I completely agree. Like, put that, that sentiment up on a pedestal.

[00:05:21] Sarah Goddard: Completely agree with that. So often it is about someone who’s. Found out a little bit about us. Come across our website, maybe seen a community fundraiser out and about in the wild if you like, and gone, oh yeah, I wanna hear a bit more about that charity. I’ll pop my name and and details down. And if they then don’t hear from you for six weeks, ’cause that’s when your next email goes out or you know they’re gonna have forgotten about you by that point.

[00:05:41] Sarah Goddard: You know, the point of engagement appointment, a supporter takes action is their most important time because that is when they’re excited, it’s when they’re motivated, it’s when something has moved them. Keep that feeling going and keep that thing going. So yeah, in its simplest term, the welcome journeys are, what is that series of emails or series of communications, because it doesn’t all have to be by email, um, that supporters first receive when they first take an action.

[00:06:06] Sarah Goddard: Equally, as I say, it doesn’t have to be online. If a supporter has sent in a check or even if they’ve made the donation online, there’s nothing saying you can’t send them a lovely thank. Well, you should be sending them a lovely thank you letter or a lovely thank you regardless. But you can pop that in the post.

[00:06:19] Sarah Goddard: You could pick up the phone. Like there are lots of different ways that you can engage that supporter, um, and thinking about that creatively. ’cause we all get far too many emails. We all lose sight of emails. So think about how we can best engage people. But then there’s also about that welcome at different points as well and different forms of welcome.

[00:06:36] Sarah Goddard: So for your community supporters, for your event supporters, what does that welcome look like? When someone signs up to do something, when someone picks up the phone to say they’re doing their bake sale, or fill in the online form to register for your color run, is that welcome? Maximizing their excitement about that activity they’re doing, or is it a basically a receipt and a bit meh, and a bit boring and a bit, and then you’re having to work twice, three times as hard to get that excitement back.

[00:07:00] Sarah Goddard: Um, so that’s, I guess, in its simplest terms. Then I also have a, a term that I call transitionary journeys, which is about welcoming supporters from one area of the charity when they move into another, which is, should ultimately be the, the game. And, but it’s the same basic principle. It’s just how are we communicating with our supporters to continue inspiring and exciting them about the actions they can take to see some change in the world.

[00:07:21] Sarah Goddard: Really, 

[00:07:22] Simon Scriver: it’s, yeah, it’s like, it’s like that bridge between acquisition and retention, isn’t it? It’s like that, like you said, that point where they first come in, they are. They’re wanting something. They’ve, they’ve moved, they’ve taken action, which we are, we’re always so desperate to, you know, we spend so much money trying to acquire these people.

[00:07:39] Simon Scriver: Mm-hmm. But then we have this, often, this disjoint in the middle where it’s like they come in for one reason under some certain circumstances, and we are driving them away before we can really like. What is it? What is it? Are we rushing to get them where we want them? You know, we’re trying to turn them into something they’re not and we’re not holding their hands through.

[00:07:57] Simon Scriver: The experience is, is that where the problem is coming 

[00:07:59] Sarah Goddard: from? I actually think it might be the opposite. I think it’s often in charity sector, we’re too slow to try and get that second action, and we’re actually, we are really scared. We’re like the, talk about it as being the little, um, pangolin creatures we’re like, or, or please could you possibly, maybe.

[00:08:14] Sarah Goddard: Do something next maybe, but it takes us months and months and months to ask them that. Um, events is my key example here is, you know, someone would’ve spent six months training and fundraising and doing amazing things for say, London Marathon, and then they’ve had all this great engagement, all of this great stewardship, and then the communication drops off a cliff until five months later they’re sent a Christmas appeal.

[00:08:34] Sarah Goddard: And they’re like, well, I’ve not heard from you in between time, what’s going on? Because we were too shy, too nervous, too worried about offending to give them any other action in between time. 

[00:08:43] Jade Cunnah: Mm-hmm. 

[00:08:44] Sarah Goddard: Oh, but the Christmas appeal, that’s the banker appeal. We need to send that to everyone that we’ve got in the database.

[00:08:47] Sarah Goddard: We’ll send it to all of those community events people. But they’ve had nothing in between. And it’s the same with individual giving. It’s not actually the first gift that’s the hardest. It’s the second. And I think, I remember when I was in, I’d love to hear from other ideas what you’re seeing data wise, but actually prime time to make that second ask was within sort of six to eight weeks, which you say that to many fundraisers and particularly fundraisers, smaller charities.

[00:09:07] Sarah Goddard: And they go, what? That’s so soon. But that’s, it might not be a second gift. Maybe it’s just another action. Maybe it’s a micro action, maybe it’s a share. This post, it’s give your supporters the opportunity to still keep being involved in doing something and just vary and test what that second action is.

[00:09:24] Simon Scriver: We, we make assumptions sometimes about our people that like our, our, when they join our list, you know, we almost assume that they’re gonna do the work. They’re gonna go explore our website and they’re gonna know what the next logical step is. And if they wanted to help more, they would, but. I mean, that’s, that’s really a false assumption, isn’t it?

[00:09:42] Simon Scriver: Like we have to kind of put ourselves in front of ’em, like all forms of fundraising, surely. 

[00:09:46] Sarah Goddard: Yeah. Yeah, definitely. It’s, I think we forget that when we’re in the detail of something, we are seeing all of these different things. We are in the trees, we think that everyone else knows what’s in our brains. And actually a no one else knows what’s in our brains at all, but especially not our supporters.

[00:10:00] Sarah Goddard: They’re not thinking like fundraisers or thinking like charity staff. They don’t know what the other options are. And I’ve got, um, there’s some data a while back. Now, it’d be great to see this research redone, but about asking supporters why did they give? And it was something like 30% of them said, ’cause I was asked.

[00:10:14] Sarah Goddard: Yeah. 

[00:10:15] Jade Cunnah: And I actually 

[00:10:15] Sarah Goddard: think it’s, you know, it’s actually a higher number than that. And also people just don’t know what the next step is. I was talking to a community fundraiser the other day on my training course who shared a beautiful story that I think sums it up where there was a minister of a church who said, oh, could you come along and represent the charity, uh, by reading this hymn?

[00:10:31] Sarah Goddard: We’re gonna read a hymn for everyone that your charity supports, and this fundraiser said, okay. That’s, that’s very nice. Thank you. Is there an opportunity to do something else? Could we hold a collection? Could I ask you to sign up to email list, et cetera, et cetera. And this, this minister was like, oh, hadn’t even thought of that.

[00:10:47] Sarah Goddard: All I thought about was the hymn and in praying for the people your charity works for. But yes, you’re right. That probably would be quite helpful. 

[00:10:53] Jade Cunnah: And 

[00:10:53] Sarah Goddard: this lovely community fundraiser, I’m sure kept a beautifully professional facing and that’s wonderful. Thank you so much. Turned up to spend an hour at this church service to, to read a hy actually, that’s gonna.

[00:11:04] Sarah Goddard: Make a very tangible difference, as well as that beautiful engagement with the community is that collection and is the money that they’re going to raise. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, yeah, our supporters just aren’t in our heads and in knowing what the next step is, they’re just in their world. So, for example, this minister, he’s in his world of, it’s a church and they’re gonna read to him and say a prayer makes perfect sense to him.

[00:11:22] Jade Cunnah: Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:11:23] Sarah Goddard: Fundraisers we’re like, could we. Past the collection plate round. That’d be fab. Thanks. 

[00:11:27] Simon Scriver: Yeah. I mean, I suppose we’re guilty of doing it ourselves. Sometimes as fundraisers or as marketing people, we, we like forget where we are trying to bring people and then it’s like, you know, you’re sending them these emails, you’re sending them these blogs or whatever, and it’s like, I.

[00:11:41] Simon Scriver: What is our actual goal with this? Are we just like keeping in touch for the sake of keeping in touch? Or is the goal to move them to monthly is the goal to get their company involved? Like, and, and so I guess that brings me onto really like, how do you approach this? And, and I would love anyone who’s watching this live.

[00:11:56] Simon Scriver: Um, um, please do comment. Um, and anyone who’s listening black back, please do reach out to us. But I, I had a really interesting conversation last year with, I think it was Claire Donna from More Onion. And she was talking about welcome journey journeys, a little bit about how, you know, really that first, I think she said almost six to 12 months.

[00:12:14] Simon Scriver: You might not be putting people into the general pot of communications, but having like its own dedicated welcome journey for that full 12 months, like that is the welcome journey. It’s very special. So I’m just curious in, in terms of your thoughts on a practical level, how do you start mapping out this welcome journey in an organization when you work with one of your clients?

[00:12:34] Simon Scriver: Like. What does that, what does that map look like? Is it a big drawing? Is it like a step by step in Excel? Just maybe you could talk us through the process a bit. 

[00:12:42] Sarah Goddard: Yeah, yeah, definitely. I think that’s really interesting. Um, from more on, you know, it being six to 12 months and I think I’d love to see how different charities have tested that and looked at that, because that to me sounds really, really exciting and something I’d love to see charities doing.

[00:12:55] Sarah Goddard: The flip side though, I think is, I work a lot with smaller and medium sized charities and the resource that a small charity has 

[00:13:02] Jade Cunnah: Yeah. Looks 

[00:13:02] Sarah Goddard: very, very different to even a medium charity, let alone the larger charities. And what I always say with my clients is we’re gonna start with where you are at and start with your resource.

[00:13:11] Sarah Goddard: And I always, always, always advocate with your big, small, medium in between. If you’re just getting started, done is better than perfect. 

[00:13:18] Jade Cunnah: Mm-hmm. 

[00:13:18] Sarah Goddard: Start simple and build onto it. It is much, much easier to start with a simple and effective journey and series of communications and do it beautifully and do it well and track some results.

[00:13:31] Sarah Goddard: Then try and have a wall of post-it notes with if this, then that. And if they do that, then they go that way. But if they go there, they go that way. If I had a pound every time I sat in a conference room with a wall full of post-it notes and all of these complicated journeys and if statements and this, that, and the other, and it never gets implemented.

[00:13:46] Sarah Goddard: Or if it does, it gets implemented really, really poorly and it breaks and it falls down and support. The bottom line is supporters don’t get communicated with. They don’t get stewarded. They don’t get welcomed, and it all falls apart. Mm-hmm. So I’m a massive, massive, massive advocate, advocate, advocate for.

[00:14:06] Sarah Goddard: And the, the process I normally recommend to charities as a start of a 10, just rather than that blank sheet of paper, is your yearly communications journey. Mm-hmm. At least one email a month, which is a stewardship piece. It’s a story, it’s impact of your work. It’s beautiful saying, this is the point of what we do, right.

[00:14:22] Sarah Goddard: This is why we are here. And you can tie that international days into things happening at your charity into, you know, whatever it might be, but at least one a month that is just pure stewardship. A beautiful news piece and story of your work. Then in between that you’ve got space for every two weeks to have what could be a call to action.

[00:14:38] Sarah Goddard: That doesn’t mean you’re going to have something every month that’s a call to action, but that’s when you start to slot in your Christmas appeal, your wear a funny hat day, you are selling this petition for our local mp, whatever it might be. Mm-hmm. So again, that call to action can be one clear call to action.

[00:14:53] Sarah Goddard: It’s not trying to ask your supporters to do 1,000,001 things. And then within that as well, it’s thinking about, well, what else do you do offline? Because most charities are gonna be looking at email. But again, do you have supporters addresses? Do you have the opportunity to send that petition or that Christmas appeal or whatever in the post?

[00:15:09] Sarah Goddard: Mm-hmm. Do you have the opportunity in there to send a stewardship piece in the post? And I would recommend if. Resource allows about four times a year. So once a quarter, give or take and alternate, ask stewardship, ask stewardship. Stewardship could be a newsletter. It could just be a little thank you postcard.

[00:15:23] Sarah Goddard: But again, it’s those different ways and opportunities to engage your supporters. And then layered over that is the all important welcome journey. Now, I generally recommend charities an email welcome journey with maybe one offline communication if you’ve got there. Details, so like maybe a postcard or a phone call, whatever your resource allows for, and I generally sort of say a welcome journey of sort of four to six emails, give or take.

[00:15:47] Jade Cunnah: Mm-hmm. 

[00:15:47] Sarah Goddard: Over maybe sort of six to eight weeks. To 12 weeks. Again, depends on resource, depends on what stories you have to tell. Depends on what you’re trying to engage supporters with. Now that is based very much on resource of small charities. Is this feasible? Can you do this? Because then you can start to build on that.

[00:16:02] Sarah Goddard: Actually, if you’ve got the capacity to build out that welcome journey, to be a separate journey to your main comms over a year. Beautiful. Do it and test that. Mm-hmm. But get the basics done brilliantly first and then bolt on and then add on, and then look at your data and tweak and amend rather than trying to do it all straight out the gate because it, it won’t work quite simply.

[00:16:20] Sarah Goddard: It’s better to do something and do it well. 

[00:16:22] Simon Scriver: Yeah. I think, I think you made some really great points there about priorities and resources and, and we might just unpack that a bit because I think like, yeah, one of the things like we do overcomplicate it sometimes, you know, and we try and like. If we start with our big list, I was just talking about this on LinkedIn, start with our big list, and then we’re trying to carve it up into all these different combinations, but sometimes it’s just about focusing on maybe, maybe the most, where most of your leads or most of your emails are coming from.

[00:16:47] Simon Scriver: So if, if most people are signing up through your website and they’re joining. That might be one segment that you start with and not like they get bogged down with everything else, but just focus on one thing. So there’s that kind of priorities thing that, where else would you generally see priorities?

[00:17:01] Simon Scriver: Like where are the quick wins when you’re working with clients and where are, yeah, what, what do you normally see falling down? 

[00:17:06] Sarah Goddard: Absolutely. Again, it really depends on where their, their people are coming from. I think one of the overlooked opportunities, particularly at small charities is that community fundraising piece.

[00:17:15] Sarah Goddard: So is your people that are coming to you and going, I’m gonna do a baked salad. I’m gonna sell my stuff on vintage, I’m gonna volunteer my time, I’m gonna run the leads marathon, you know, whatever, whatever it might be. And um, particularly small charities where there maybe isn’t a solid. Stewardship program, they’re probably being stewarded beautifully, one-on-one by a really passionate relationship community fundraiser.

[00:17:33] Sarah Goddard: Stunning, gorgeous. We love to see that until the charity starts to get so many of those supporters, that that poor fundraiser starts to get a bit overwhelmed, and that when you need a bit more of a, of a tailored, um, planned out stewardship journey for those supporters. But again, it’s about when they finish that fundraising, then what?

[00:17:49] Sarah Goddard: Then what do we do with them? Because again, for a lot of small charities, those engaged supporters who just really care about what you’re doing and want to be a part of it. And they’ll have done that thing that’s initially inspired them. But then how do we take them on that journey to what’s next? And I also see this with medium charities where I’ve got community fundraisers who are like, I really want to do that welcome journey.

[00:18:08] Sarah Goddard: I wanted that transitionary journey, but I need to get marketing buy-in. I need to work with ig. I need to do this, I need to do that. And that can be a constantly moving puzzle piece to try and understand that. Um, but again, it’s a do what you can. So actually a part of your community stewardship also includes in that transitionary journey.

[00:18:27] Sarah Goddard: That is at least in your sphere of control and influence, to take them on that transitionary journey into talking about the wider charity before they go into that broader pot. And it’s better to do that and do that well for that group of supporters before trying to build it out with others as well. So I think, yeah, don’t, don’t get stuck on, we need to have this done for every group of supporters and it needs to be perfect.

[00:18:45] Sarah Goddard: Start with one segment and start with the one that, as you say, look at your data. Where are most of your supporters coming from? Mm-hmm. Is it that you host a conference every year and most people on your email list is ’cause they came along to that conference, meaning maybe they’re more academically or service-based incline, so therefore your supporter comms maybe needs to look a little bit different ’cause you need to talk to ’em about that before going in on the fundraising stuff.

[00:19:06] Jade Cunnah: Mm-hmm. Um, 

[00:19:07] Sarah Goddard: not every communication is gonna be perfect for every single person. It, with all the segmentation and all the data analysis in the world. You’re gonna get an email that goes to someone where it doesn’t meet their exact values or motivations because you are not a mind reader. Quite simply. You dunno everyone’s preferences and insights and interests.

[00:19:23] Sarah Goddard: So do as much as you can with the data you have and accept the done is better than perfect would be my suggest. 

[00:19:29] Simon Scriver: Yeah, I think that’s a real, really realistic thing to highlight. Once you get into automations and grouping things, there will be stuff that. Isn’t perfectly fit for it, but you’ve made a great point there.

[00:19:37] Simon Scriver: Like when you start with small organizations, they usually have the very best welcome journeys because they’re one-to-one. Mm-hmm. And I think like that’s a really interesting way to approach this is, is you’re trying to like still keep that one-to-one feeling, but you are like, I. Grouping people so that you can just send them the same thing and kind of save that bulk stuff.

[00:19:55] Simon Scriver: You, you talked about community fundraising, I will say to anyone who’s listening or watching this, a reminder that Sarah is curating our, uh, the Fundraising Everywhere Community Fundraising conference, which is happening on the 19th of June. We’ll be unpacking a lot of the community stuff and Sarah will be hosting that herself.

[00:20:11] Simon Scriver: We’ve got some great speakers for that. But Sarah, you drew like a really distinct, clear distinction there with like, um, say for example, your donors. Versus your community fundraisers, the people who are running the marathon for you. I mean, those are two, what seems like two very clearly different welcome journeys.

[00:20:28] Simon Scriver: And when you talk about those transitional journeys, you’re trying to move them different places presumably. So is that the kind of thing that that people watching this should be starting with are, is it those easy distinctions between like. Event fundraisers and your VIPs and stuff, where do, where do they start when they’re, if they’re getting their first audiences together?

[00:20:49] Sarah Goddard: Sure. I’d say yes and no. 

[00:20:53] Simon Scriver: That’s the answer to everything in fundraising, isn’t it? It’s, it depends or yes and no. 

[00:20:59] Sarah Goddard: So. I think the key difference between donors, for example, and your community fundraisers, is that because your community fundraisers are doing something that is gonna be over a bit more of a prolonged period of time, whether it’s a bake sale in two weeks or a marathon in six months, there’s a bit more of a multi-step stewardship journey for the action that they’re doing because you’re gonna be giving them fundraising ideas and training tips and telling ’em thank you, and maybe going along to their event or whatever, whatever it might be.

[00:21:23] Sarah Goddard: So there’s gonna be. Multiple steps in that stewardship for the action that they’re taking. And often then a higher return on investment on that because that person’s gonna raise a thousand pounds in a marathon or 500 from their bake sale for multiple steps, whereas your donor that’s given 20 pounds on your website, um.

[00:21:39] Sarah Goddard: You should hope. Absolutely have a beautiful thank you for them. And it doesn’t just have to be digital. You can pick up the phone, send something offline, et cetera. But there were significantly fewer steps connected to that key action. But actually the thing that look, so that’s where it’s different.

[00:21:53] Sarah Goddard: However, when we then think about what other, then follow on communications once that action is completed. Mm-hmm. So Donor gives 20 quid. Donor gets beautiful. Thank you. Donor. Gets a couple of email, welcome. Journey goes onto an email. Welcome journey. Supporter has signed up to do the marathon. It’s all the gorgeous stewardship.

[00:22:09] Sarah Goddard: Knows more about your charity, but maybe in a very specific way than what does their welcome journey look like. This is where you it. Those journeys don’t have to look drastically different in terms of. Those journeys should share impact, share stories, share different voices within your charity. So don’t have it all come from the director of fundraising or the ceo.

[00:22:30] Sarah Goddard: Have an email. Come from a nurse in your hospice. Have an email come from someone who’s working on the frontline. Have it come from a family member. If you can get, you know, permissions and all that. Good jazz. Have different voices, different content, different ways of talking about why your charity is here.

[00:22:45] Sarah Goddard: Um, woven into that are the opportunities to be involved in other ways, micro actions. Follow us on social media, forward this email, sign this petition. Cheer at the next London Marathon cheer point. Offer the opportunities to be involved and don’t pigeonhole and silo your supporters. These are donors.

[00:23:01] Sarah Goddard: We’re only gonna ask them for money. These are community fundraisers. We’re only gonna ask them to do things. Actually, your community fundraisers may really want to give a regular gift. Your donor might be your next amazing marathon runner. And when charities start siloing and pigeonholing and only talking to them in a certain way, it’s when you are limiting your fundraising.

[00:23:18] Jade Cunnah: Mm. 

[00:23:18] Sarah Goddard: And this is again, where I’d say small charities actually have the superpowers because those silos often don’t already exist. They just are our supporters and that’s what we need to get to, is they are our supporters. And it’s just about offering different opportunities at different times to inspire them and.

[00:23:33] Sarah Goddard: We are never gonna be an expert at making the exact right ask at the exact right time. We’ve just gotta test things and try it out. 

[00:23:38] Simon Scriver: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think, I think that’s such an important point about silos. And it’s funny that like those silos are manmade creations. Like they’re not there from the beginning because people are, are donors or are fundraisers.

[00:23:50] Simon Scriver: They are just humans who, who experience different things. And so it always amazes me that we do sometimes really box off. Like we will not ask our fundraisers. For donations and we weren’t, but, but I mean, audiences like that are surely gonna be higher performing than cold, than trying to like get brand new people in who’ve never heard of your organization.

[00:24:10] Jade Cunnah: Always. 

[00:24:11] Simon Scriver: Why do, why do we do it? Is it literally just a departmental thing or is it the fear of scaring off donors again? Like I don’t, 

[00:24:19] Sarah Goddard: where does it come from? It’s a little bit of that fear of like, well, we can’t override. I think there’s, I also be very interested to see the global divide in this, if anyone’s listening from different countries where they maybe don’t have this fear.

[00:24:29] Sarah Goddard: But I definitely see those little, those little Pangolin creatures of being the most British. They’re not British. They live in, I don’t wanna say South America, um, but they just feel like they epitomize sort of British culture. Or Please, if you wouldn’t mind, I’m so sorry to ask. I’m so sorry to. Face if you wouldn’t, you know, this sort of scared approach of, um, not wanting to over ask or overdo things.

[00:24:47] Sarah Goddard: Agile supporters want the opportunity to be involved. 

[00:24:50] Jade Cunnah: Mm-hmm. 

[00:24:50] Sarah Goddard: If we don’t get, and I think my best example of this is there’s a local charity to me who are just beautiful. They do gorgeous, gorgeous work with women who don’t have like. Uh, necessarily the right to remain, leave to remain and under fives.

[00:25:02] Sarah Goddard: And they basically just give these moms and babies a safe place to play a vegetarian meal and access to services from other charities like Shelter or the government or whatever, which they wouldn’t have normally had access to. And for that charity, I’ve done fundraising. I’ve sat on their fundraising committee.

[00:25:15] Sarah Goddard: I go and pick up buggies and deliver them. I talk about ’em on a daily basis, it seems like I would never consider myself a regular donor or a volunteer. I’m just, I support that charity ’cause they’re gorgeous and I think they do great work and that’s what your supporters are thinking. So we need to take these manmade boxes we’ve built around our departments and around our groups of donors and around everything else, and break them down and say.

[00:25:37] Sarah Goddard: Our supporters want the opportunity to be involved. Our supporters want to hear about the impact of their gifts, and our supporters want to be thanked. This is a model that I use a lot, that I’ve talked about, which is the three dials of stewardship, which bits you dial up or dial down. The gratitude, the impact, and the opportunity to be involved in other ways, and that’s the bit that we miss off.

[00:25:55] Sarah Goddard: And we just need to put this British Pangolin fear to one side because as long as we’re asking politely and with reason, and actually it’s not about asking, it’s about giving the opportunity. 

[00:26:07] Alex Aggidis: Then our 

[00:26:07] Sarah Goddard: supporters will take up those opportunities when it works for them. When it doesn’t work for them, it’ll be a no thanks, but very, very rarely will your supporters be offended that you dared ask.

[00:26:14] Sarah Goddard: And if they did well. Okay. What would you like us to do? Not right to you anymore. Okay. No problem. Mr. Jones, thank you again for your support in the past. Like, 

[00:26:22] Simon Scriver: it’s funny, and I mean, don’t get me started on the Brits, but like in in the example like the organization that you are passionate about. It’s like you, you sound really passionate about it, but I imagine you’re not thinking about it 24 7.

[00:26:34] Simon Scriver: You know? And I imagine you don’t know every single thing that’s going on in there and every single thing they need. So like you said, it’s like opportunity. Sometimes it’s just like putting the opportunity in front of people and then it may be fits or it may doesn’t, but it’s, I. There’s, there’s a, there’s a reason to, to make these put time into these journeys and these communications isn’t there?

[00:26:53] Sarah Goddard: Yeah, absolutely. And that, that charity, they’re a small charity, a limited resource. I helped ’em set up their email list many years ago, and I haven’t had emails from ’em in a long time. I dunno if I’ve been taken off the list, if it’s been a spam issue, if they maybe just didn’t have the resource to keep sending those emails, whatever it might be.

[00:27:07] Sarah Goddard: And every now and again, I go. I need to drop them an email and ask them about that and see if I can help. Yeah. When I’m a fundraising consultant, I do that 24 7 and I love that charity and I don’t always remember to drop ’em that email. If they sent an email out to previous volunteers and went, can anyone help us sort out our email list, I’d be like, oh, amazing.

[00:27:22] Sarah Goddard: Brilliant. Yes, of course I can. No worries. Like that’s 

[00:27:25] Simon Scriver: fine. Yeah. Um, uh, we we’re coming towards the end, but this, this concept you have of transitionary journeys, like, it’s really interesting and we got, we actually got an email to, to, um, fundraising everywhere the other day, and it was asking about people’s likelihood to move from one audience to the other and things like that.

[00:27:42] Simon Scriver: Do you have any, I mean fundraisers fundraiser sarah.com is um, is the website, fundraiser sarah.com Do get on Sarah’s mail list and do follow Sarah on LinkedIn, ’cause Sarah shares some really great tips. But in terms of that, that transitionary, so I’m trying to catch myself on saying it transitionary. Um, any, any other big highlights from that?

[00:28:01] Simon Scriver: Obviously people are gonna come to the community fundraising conference, learn loads about all this stuff, but any other like, jump out things in that transitionary in, in terms of these journeys and how we get people to do more than they originally signed up for. What’s your thoughts? 

[00:28:14] Sarah Goddard: Yeah, it’s again, just get it in place.

[00:28:17] Sarah Goddard: I often ask when I do this session at conferences and things like that, I say, who has beautiful stewardship for your community? Fundraisers, events, fundraisers, et cetera. And how many of them then fall off a cliff at the end of that journey, only to be sent the Christmas appeal, the newsletter every six months later and everyone sort of sheepishly puts their hand up.

[00:28:32] Sarah Goddard: I’m like, how many of them fall off the cliff and never get. Anything again until the next year’s marathon or whatever, and the, the rest of the room’s hands sheepishly go up and I’m like, just get something in place. So again, that three to five email journey that takes your supporters from you did the marathon, you’re epic, you’re amazing.

[00:28:47] Sarah Goddard: You smashed it. You’re so awesome. Here are some other areas of our charity we may not have talked about over the last six 

[00:28:52] Jade Cunnah: months. 

[00:28:52] Sarah Goddard: Here’s someone else’s voice. Here’s other ways you can be involved. That doesn’t mean to send them a list of absolutely everything, but again, give them some micro actions and in your final communication, it’s, we’re gonna stay in touch.

[00:29:03] Sarah Goddard: You’ll get regular emails from us, monthly emails, whatever it is, and we’ll also let you know about other ways you can get involved because we know you care. Bring it back to them and their motivations. We know you care about reason your charity exists because you raised 2,500 pounds running the marathon for a few epic thing you.

[00:29:18] Sarah Goddard: So we’re gonna stay in touch and let you know about other ways you can help. Make change here. So just bring it back to those motivations and support and get something in place so that the communications don’t drop off a cliff after six months of gorgeous stewardship to only be sent something again a year later.

[00:29:32] Sarah Goddard: ’cause then they won’t respond. But if you keep the communication consistent and keep those little asks or opportunities more to say, woven in there, people be more likely to take up those opportunities because they know they exist in the first place. 

[00:29:45] Simon Scriver: You make, you make it sound so logical. And I think that, that there’s a truth to that.

[00:29:48] Simon Scriver: It’s like some of this stuff we are, it is quite. It’s not obvious, but when you sit down and think of it as a, as a supporter, like if I was doing the marathon and I raised this, what would I want to hear? What’s the logical thing when we put time aside to think it through? It kind of, it kind of does all make sense.

[00:30:05] Simon Scriver: It’s just. What, what is it? I feel like it’s maybe when we’re looking at spreadsheets and data, it’s like, it’s hard to forget about the individuals that are going through, but 

[00:30:13] Sarah Goddard: we like to overcomplicate things. I think we like to think it’s, that’s that sort of chimp paradox, isn’t it? We like to think where these highly intellectual, academic data-driven beings that must make all decisions in this very intellectual way, blah, blah, blah.

[00:30:27] Sarah Goddard: Oh yes. Oh yes. Um, yeah. We want to overcomplicate things and actually. Take it back to basics, take it back to human-centric people-focused basics of good, clear communication of storytelling, of honest, authentic gratitude. And you can always build out from there. You can always add in lovely, complicated, wizzy, clever things, but just take it back to basics.

[00:30:50] Sarah Goddard: Do the basics brilliantly and the rest will follow. That’s my general mantra on it. 

[00:30:55] Simon Scriver: I think that’s great and I think it, it, it’s like you said earlier, it’s almost emulating those that first, those first days of a charity when you’re really small. And it’s your first donor or your first supporter, it’s like.

[00:31:06] Simon Scriver: Naturally the journey is perfect. You know, and it’s like, how can we, how can we bring that in? Sarah, it’s been so great chatting to you and, and, and I always love, um, getting your thoughts on this. I will say to everyone, um, find fundraiser, uh, fundraiser, sarah@fundraisersarah.com. Uh, fundraiser sarah.com is the website and there’s some great resources on there.

[00:31:25] Simon Scriver: And Sarah, you’re great on LinkedIn. I would highly recommend people follow you, uh, on LinkedIn. Sarah Godard. Where, where are you spending most of your times these days online to get your knowledge and, and things like that. You’re going to uh, going in a lot on LinkedIn into the group. Yeah, 

[00:31:39] Sarah Goddard: LinkedIn and Instagram.

[00:31:40] Sarah Goddard: I’ve been having a lot of fun with like reels and trending things and being a bit silly. I’m a performing arts kid at heart. That’s where I started like, 

[00:31:46] Jade Cunnah: oh my God, anything 

[00:31:48] Sarah Goddard: gets to me. Having a bit of a laugh, being a bit silly, but balancing that with actually genuine, like helpful tips and things like that as well.

[00:31:54] Sarah Goddard: So yeah, Instagram, LinkedIn, that’s where to come find me fundraiser there on both. Um. And yes, always feel free to send me messages, tell me what you wanna hear more of as well. So always helpful to know what people actually want to know about. 

[00:32:05] Simon Scriver: So Amazing. Yeah, I’d second that. And Sarah’s stuff is great, entertaining and useful, but do reach out to her.

[00:32:10] Simon Scriver: And Sarah Reminder, um, for everyone that Sarah is curating our community fundraising conference, so the Fundraising Everywhere Community Fundraising conference is happening on the 19th of June. How’s it looking, Sarah? I haven’t looked at, I haven’t looked at the program, I’ll be honest, in a few weeks, but it’s so 

[00:32:25] Sarah Goddard: exciting.

[00:32:26] Sarah Goddard: There are so many brilliant speakers and from such a wide range of charities as well. So there’s gonna be so many practical tips for big, small, medium charities. Um, there’s a couple of fab people, Redco, Smoss, and Mon Send. They’re both drawing on marketing expertise. So again, bringing this world of community marketing together.

[00:32:41] Sarah Goddard: Together. Um, we’ve got a fabulous panel of speakers who have built their careers starting out in community fundraising and are now doing epic leadership roles across the sector. They’re gonna be hugely inspiring to hear from, um, and way more. Go to the website, go and check out all the speakers and buy your ticket because you’re gonna wanna be there ’cause it’s going to be 

[00:32:58] Simon Scriver: epic.

[00:32:59] Simon Scriver: Amazing. Yeah, absolutely. I’m really looking forward to this and people are getting excited about it. So do check it out@fundraisingeverwhere.com. You can find all of our events, but we’ve also got a link here. Uh, whether you are watching this or listening back to it, you’ll find we’ll find a link in the description.

[00:33:13] Simon Scriver: So join us all at the Community fundraising conference on 19th of June. Uh, and you will have, uh, the recordings available to watch back if you can’t join us live. Sarah, thank you so much for your time. It’s been so lovely chatting to you. Um, but I’m gonna say goodbye to you and, and say to you, I hope you enjoy the rest.

[00:33:28] Simon Scriver: To your day, but thank you for your time. 

[00:33:30] Sarah Goddard: Thank you Simon. Thank you. It’s always fab talking fundraising with you too. 

[00:33:33] Simon Scriver: Good. I love it. And thank you all for listening or thank you for watching live. Uh, we will see you, uh, we’ll, we have our supporter Experience conference coming up first. Um, but then next month the Community Fundraising Conference.

[00:33:44] Simon Scriver: You will see both Sarah and I. Thank you for listening. Uh, thank you for watching. Thank you for being part of the Fundraising Everywhere community and we’ll see you again soon. Take care. All. 

[00:33:54] Alex Aggidis: Thank you so much for listening to the Fundraising Everywhere podcast. If you’re enjoying this podcast, why not share it with a fundraising friend?

[00:34:01] Alex Aggidis: And if you would like to give us a little ly or subscribe, it really helps more fundraisers like you find us. Thank you so much. See you next time.

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